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Thread: Project Red Rocket!

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by NXcoupe View Post
    Joe, yep its def limited by the camshaft lift and duration coupled with the head flow and crappy combustion chamber. A rod broke in mine the other day just cruising along. I think it was from earlier on when i first got it going and had timing and boost control issues I will go over in this build thread eventually. I'm gonna toss another stocker 2.3 in and experiment with that while i build another one.
    Ahh! Are 2.3s easy to find? I really need to grab another motor myself just incase. I know things now that I would like to do but I'd should save money and just whipple or tvs the cobra. I just started my build to make it actually enjoyable to merge onto the highway without fearing for my life,haha.
    Joe

  2. #42
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    Yep. They are pretty cheap. Would like to toss a 2.5 in it and experiment with that before I build one, but not sure it will fit in a stang and the various brkts swap over. I also ordered a boost gauge, wideband and fuel pressure gauge so i can monitor wtf going on under the hood. I know what you mean, my coupe is a blast to drive. I'd run to pick up parts just to get out and drive it. Going up hills in 5th was a breeze. Miss it already. Got to fix some framerail rust while the engine's out anyway so I have time.

  3. #43
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    What turbo are you running?
    Joe

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by PKFIRE View Post
    What turbo are you running?
    I believe it is a 57 trim, but can't remember, it's either that or a 50 trim. I ordered a boost gauge, fuel pressure gauge, and a wideband for it from glowshift. Cheap gauges that will keep this from happening again I hope.

  5. #45
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    So next I started running the tubing from the intercooler up to where the turbo was gonna be. I put two 90* pipes out of the intercooler and then put the blow off valve on. It then ran into the factory radiator hose bracket:


    After getting that out of the way, I ended up with a little better positioning of the hoses and BOV:


  6. #46
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    So then it was time to move up to the engine and start taking things apart. I took the airbox and maf sensor and inlet tubing all out, and I unbolted the stock exhaust manifold from the head.



    Then I set the new turbo header down into the engine bay to mock it up.



    Bad news, was that the positioning of the waste gate couldn't have been worse. It was pointed towards the front and hit the a/c compressor and lines. So I took it to a guy and had him cut the tube off and weld it to the back, then weld up the hole on the front. Turned out great, and don't know why they don't do it that way in the first place. Here is me positioning the wastegate where it should be so he could weld the bung in this orientation. A picture speaks a thousand words when you are trying to relay fab work you want done. You can also see where the old bung location was peaking out from under the a/c hose.




    After test fitting it, I realized the coil packs weren't going to be able to stay in the stock location, so out went the bracket for them.



    I went ahead and bolted it into place with sealant on the flanges.

    Last edited by NXcoupe; 06-25-2016 at 10:48 AM.

  7. #47
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    Stuff I won't be using anymore.



    Then I decided it was time to move down to the oil drain in the pan. Dave let me use his supply and drain kit from his On3 kit so I used their fittings and line for the most part. I drilled a hole into the aluminum oil pan and then tapped it with a 3/8" pipe tap coated with grease to keep the aluminum shavings to a minimum. I also rinsed out the hole and pan with brake clean and drained it all out. I put silicone on the fitting and screwed it into the pan.



  8. #48
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    I have to upload more pics to photobucket so I can finish my thread, but in the meantime I bought a 91 LX hatch that has an 8 plug 2.3 in it. It runs decent, going to at least put an oil pump on it and new main and rod bearings. May hone it and put rings in it as well, but not sure yet. May just leave them alone as it didn't seem to smoke at all. I want to get mine out and see what's wrong with it and go from there first.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by NXcoupe View Post
    I have to upload more pics to photobucket so I can finish my thread, but in the meantime I bought a 91 LX hatch that has an 8 plug 2.3 in it. It runs decent, going to at least put an oil pump on it and new main and rod bearings. May hone it and put rings in it as well, but not sure yet. May just leave them alone as it didn't seem to smoke at all. I want to get mine out and see what's wrong with it and go from there first.
    What power are you planning on making? Are you planning on running e85 and 20 psi?
    Joe

  10. #50
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    As soon as I was done with the install, the plan was to run the 87 in the tank out of it and then convert it to E85 in the tune. It's been on E85 since I finished it and drove it to the gas station and filled up with it. Lol. I'd say 350 or so rwhp is what my ultimate goal is with it. I know that will require a good solid shortblock and a custom camshaft as well. I plan to build that eventually but first I'm going to test the limits of the stock engine, with this next one being a true test since the tune is dialed in and the boost controller is letting the wastegate open now.

  11. #51
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    So after I got the intake all siliconed and tightened up, I installed the wastegate onto the manifold and man did it fit perfectly! I was really pleased that I had the guy move those around and it looked good to me as far as the welding and patch he made for it. So far it's holding up well. The ebay wastegate came with a 7 to 8 lb spring they said, which it seems to be accurate. I used copper silicone on it as well.





    In this pic you can see where I was mocking up and routing the cold side from the throttle body to the intercooler. I was happy to learn the stock tb is 2.5" OD, so the couplers in the kit worked and slid right over the TB opening. So I ran a 90* elbow from the TB then a straight and a 90* elbow down as well.

    Last edited by NXcoupe; 06-24-2016 at 11:36 PM.

  12. #52
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    Next, I set the turbo on to see how well it fit. It set right on with no issues. Only future problem could be the spark plug wire clearance, but so far I've worked around it. They are pretty close behind the turbo.



    I had to clock the turbo for the discharge and oil in and out positioning. Here you can see how it mashed into the header tube, not gonna fly. So I changed the fittings around and the clocking of the turbo and got it to clear. I put heat wrap around the drain hose just for peace of mind.


  13. #53
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    I wonder if 60lb injectors will be enough, especially if you kept the base pressure low?
    Joe

  14. #54
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    Next up I went to the parker store and purchased a 45* elbow for the turbo oil drain, so the hose would clear the header tubes, worked perfectly. Got the turbo clocked as I wanted it to be and moved on to the next step.



    I had to order three couplers and a cool little gizmo to mount the IAT sensor from Siliconeintakes.com. Great place to order from, decent prices and the hoses seem to be good quality. I had to get two reducers to go from 2.5" to 3" for the ProM ProTube I got from them years ago for this project. It fit right in with these. Then I needed an elbow that went from 2" to 2.5" to go from the turbo outlet to the 2.5" intercooler piping. Once I got these in, I moved forward with mocking up the rest of the cold side. Thought I might come up short, but it all worked out nicely.



    I mounted the ProTube inline and angled it a bit so the connector wouldn't interfere with anything moving or hot.

    Last edited by NXcoupe; 06-25-2016 at 10:33 AM.

  15. #55
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    Next, I finished up routing all the cold side, took it from the compressor out and down to the passenger side of the intercooler, then through the intercooler and out the driver's side, then 180* bend out of the intercooler and run perpendicular to the engine with the blow off valve mounted there, then a 90* up to the maf and then a 90* out of the maf and to the throttle body. Lots of clamps and bends, but it works. I went back over and started putting clamps on everything and tightening it up. I was getting really anxious to get it fired up at this point.


  16. #56
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    I took apart the 180* bends around the driver's side of the intercooler so I could put this gizmo in so the IAT would have a place to mount and give me accurate outlet temps from the intercooler. It's worked great so far.



    It's getting there, but need to figure out what to do with the coils temporarily.




  17. #57
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    I decided to mix and match the new spark plug wires and put the coils where they are sitting in this picture. It's worked well, but I want to make brackets to mount them securely. At the start, before I put the turbo on, I pulled the passenger side plugs out and gapped them down to .028. I knew there would be no getting to them after the turbo was installed.
    I routed the downpipe into position as well, I had to corkscrew it up into position. It wouldn't just slide right up in, had to spin it around and it went right in place.


  18. #58
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    I purchased the strategy for the stock computer and never really messed much with it until I got the turbo on. I had upgraded my software to the newest version and when I opened it there was a learning curve, but it was steep as I had the car running and purring in no time. I decided to strap it on the dyno and run the 87 octane out of it first. I was really excited to get this thing going so I made a few pulls on it to see what boost it would make. It made 7 psi or so on the spring, and I wasn't making full pulls yet. I was just pulling it to 3k to 3.5k or so. I put the boost controller inline that came with my wastegate and blow off valve kit, as the arrows showed me to do(no instructions, should have been my first clue) and made a quick pull on it. I had been datalogging while I was on the dyno, as I was having an issue with the tune giving a lot more timing than I was commanding(20). It was giving me 40 at wot. Not supposed to be doing that. I was working through different changes trying to figure out what was up with it, when the two things came together and hit hard, I made a pull with the new boost controller on, barely opened, and I pulled it to 3.6K. It made 28 psi and had 40* of timing! CRAP! I let off, and it made 299 rwhp and 410 ftlbs of torque!! But it had 40* of timing still. Crap. So I messed with the tune and thought I had it figured out, turned the boost controller off, so I'd have 7 psi and made a pull. It shot up fast, more boost and I let off, but not before the headgasket let go. Crap. So I licked my wounds and decided to take the weekend to fix it after I had finished up with shop work. I started pulling it apart:



    And later found this:

    Last edited by NXcoupe; 07-15-2016 at 11:46 PM.

  19. #59
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    I bought ARP headstuds for it, and a new headgasket, and a new valvecover gasket, as it was leaking anyway. I did a compression test on it before I pulled it apart, I pulled out the driver's side plugs and did the test. #1 was 135 and then #2 was 65 and 3 and 4 were next to nothing. I figured I blew the gasket in two places, but as you can see it only blew between 3 and 4. So I didn't give it much more thought and went ahead and cleaned it up and put it back together again. This time, I stifled my inner teenager and actually ran the fuel out of it driving it gently and made it to get E85 in it. I filled it up and changed the tune and started driving it around. I hit it a couple times to see if the timing was coming around to what I was commanding and it hadn't yet. I had undone pretty much everything I'd done in the tune and did to every fox style computer I'd tuned. So I drove it around datalogging it and making small changes as I went trying to work around this issue. I got frustrated one day and just put the top row to zero. Drove it around the block and wouldn't you know it, I had zero degrees advance in the datalog. Now I was completely confused. It hadn't responded to anything I'd done before, but this time it did. So I moved it to 6 degrees, drove it around the block, and VIOLA! I had 12 degrees of timing. WTF? So I went up to 8, I got 16. Then I went to 10.5, I got 21. I put it to 10 and got the 20 I had wanted forever. Finally! So with the boost controller off, I went riding around in my new toy and let my inner teen out to enjoy. I datalogged and flogged it all around the area. I was perplexed as to why the load was going to 250% sometimes, but figured I'd worry about that when I got it back on the dyno. Well, I got it back on the dyno and soon figured out that the boost controller was garbage. I was getting 20+ psi and had been driving it for a week like that. Shit. Oh well, it's my car and I can fix it if need be. I messed with the boost controller and finally gave up and put the damn thing inline and used it as a restriction. That worked, and I got it to give me 12 psi. I went on to tune the maf and get it dialed in, get the part throttle and start up tunes where I wanted them, and made a few pulls. 12 psi, 208 rwhp and 265 ft lbs of torque. Not too shabby considering this powerhouse planted 95 rwhp to the wheels a few years prior. I unstrapped it and went out to enjoy it.
    I gave rides and enjoyed it for about a month and a half to two months when I was heading home to pick up ball gloves so I could toss baseball around with my daughter at her daycare's father's day cookout. I was talking to Jason on the phone, had just filled up with a fresh tank of E85 so I was driving it cautiously and conservatively so I could get an estimate of what the best mileage was I could get out of it if I drove it with some sense. I had just shifted into 3rd gear when a loud BANG crashed under the hood, the shifter popped into neutral and smoke started coming up through the shifter boot and out the back of the car. I told Jason I had to let him go, my car had just broke and I limped the damn thing home. Got home and assessed the damage, crack in the side of the block next to #4 cylinder and evidently by the oil everywhere, a hole in the pan somewhere as well.
    I had to call AAA and ended up missing my baby's cookout, which broke her heart and made me feel like a crappy dad. It sucked on so many levels that day. I believe the overboost condition and the timing issue in the tune coupled to damage a few of the rods. A bent rod would explain the lower compression on the cylinder that wasn't blown. This thing never skipped a beat or made a weird noise, it ran flawlessly till the end. I will get it out and post pics asap and cover the .50 cent build on the next engine. I hope to get a better picture of how much power a stock 2.3 will take without failing on this go round. I am also going to get to the bottom of the boost controller deal. It should work, yes it is a cheap pos, but it should work nonetheless.

  20. #60
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    Quick rundown of what it has done to it now, and also a price estimate on what the turbo build actually cost me.

    Turbo, off ebay 159 shipped
    Header, off ebay 199 shipped
    Downpipe to Y pipe kit 279 plus about 30 bucks shipping from Stinger perf, very nice stuff tho, but pricey.
    Drain and supply kit for turbo 99.00 from On3
    T3 Turbo Blanket 89.00 from On3
    Intercooler and piping kit 179.00 shipped, I love Taco Taco, on ebay(yep, not making it up)
    Reducers, 3 of them and gizmo 85.00 Siliconeintakes.com
    MAF 309 shipped from ProM
    42 lb injectors Nothin
    Wastegate and BOV kit 79.00 came with incredible boost controller for FREE, can you believe it? EBAY as well
    So that's what it took to get it up and going. I also bought the flawed strategy from a guy online, but in all fairness, I haven't told him about the issue yet, but I will and hope he will fix it so others that follow won't fight this issue.

    Rest of the car
    GSS 340 walbro fuel pump
    Turbocoupe 8.8 3.55 gear rear axle with discs
    Front and Rear V8 sway bars
    Front V8 brakes and spindles
    V8 rack and pinion, rebuilt
    96 V6 master cylinder with reservoir
    MM 3 to 2 master cylinder conversion line kit
    MM proportioning valve eliminator plug
    SSB adjustable proportioning valve with pressure gauge
    Tokico cockpit adjustable shock and strut kit, used to be a Motorsport kit
    Caster Camber plates
    Dynomax catback for LX V8
    Ebay aluminum 2" thick radiator
    Added factory a/c picked it up from LKQ pick a part
    SPEC stage 3 clutch
    V8 3.35 T5 with custom input to fit into a 2.3L pilot bearing
    UPR Firewall cable adjuster and quadrant
    Billet UPR shifter


    After all this hassle, I've decided that I will never install any kind of boost without insisting on a boost gauge being part of the install, myself included, so I ordered glowshift boost, fuel pressure and Wideband gauges, which arrived this past week. Going in a 3 gauge pod.

    I'm looking for a 140 speedo for a 90 up airbag style dash that shows roughly 30k miles if anyone has one laying around, I'll buy it.
    Last edited by NXcoupe; 07-15-2016 at 11:50 PM.

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