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Thread: Coyote Guru Needed (Moved To Tech)

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
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    Coyote Guru Needed (Moved To Tech)

    Ok, so I was able to track down the VCT filters and got them in the car last night. I went ahead and stayed up late getting it all back together.

    Today I changed the oil and fired the car up. I spent some time making sure all of the air was out of the cooking system before taking the car down the road.

    The issue I was previously having is still there.... Iím at a loss...

    I triple checked all of the timing marks, made sure the phasers were all installed correctly and torqued to spec (using arp bolts and torque specs).

    Car still seems like it has a miss when driving.. almost wondering if itís something mechanical...


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  2. #2
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    Feb 2004
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    Did you do a crank relearn?

  3. #3
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    Feb 2017
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    92
    I have not. Does it need done?


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  4. #4
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    Feb 2017
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    Tonight I was playing with the SCTX4 that I have. I was able to complete a crank relearn after I returned to the stock tune.

    After the relearn was completed I did install the 93 tune and took the car around the block with the same issue... still sounds like a diesel truck and feels to me like the motor is missing...

    I honestly donít know what to do with this thing.


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  5. #5
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    Jan 2008
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    You are not getting any codes? My 2005 sounded like a Diesel truck when it lost a cam phaser.......a diesel truck with a severe knock because like the Coyote the 4.6L 3V is also an interference engine. My oddity was that the car would start and idle fine for EVER. But once I cracked the throttle hard and the engine settled back it would then begin a missing/knocking sound. I performed compression checks and nothing showed up. The PCM would occasionally generate a can sensor code but it was erratic. Turned out to be cam phasers...a problem that arose30-45 days after the car had been to a place in northern Indiana who I only refer to as Brand "B" to have cams installed. Needless to say they denied responsibility. The cam phasers were replaced and the problem was no more. I kept the phasers and took them apart. There was nothing obvious I could see inside them broken but again replacing them resolved the issue and it NEVER returned. I can only assume that the clock spring some how became unattached. NOt sure if the newer ones are made in a similar manner or not as Ford has improved VCT a lot since the 4.6L 3V and 5.4L 3V.

    Watch this video and listen to how the guy describes the problem. Note the tapping/interference sound in the engine. This is cam phaser failure. My 2005 actually sounded worse.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGO7GVCOWD0



    I share this for you to use as information to compare with your symptom. Not proclaiming to be an auto mechanical wizard. If we were talking CNC machine tool equipment then I could speak professionally. Just sharing my experience and general information I have on the topic. Hope to hear a resolve and HOPE IT ENDS UP BEING AN UNCOSTLY ONE.
    Redfirepearl GT

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
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    Thanks for the response.

    So data logging my car shows that bank two exhaust cam is not in sync with bank one... I replaced this phaser once when my car was on the dyno not making good power and we noticed the cam was off. Then again recently this week... From the last time the car saw the dyno until now has been about 3k trouble free miles. My car has not missed a beat since it was last tuned. However now itís off and even after replacing the phaser itís still not correct.

    I called a buddy (who works on and builds these motors) tonight getting his opinion and he thinks at this point it could be a cam issue. Iím not sure what it is but just want it resolved.

    My car does not sound like the one in the video at idle. At idle it really doesnít sound bad (cams should be at 0). Just under load (when they are supposed to move) it starts to sound like a diesel. However the motor makes no knocking noise at all.


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  7. #7
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    Jan 2008
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    Are you not getting any misfire codes? NX Coupe knows these engines and the theory well. And you say you have done a compression check on each cylinder in that bank? If not that would be my next step. There may be a valve to cam related issue mechanically somewhere as your buddy mentioned...but I would think one would still get some form of missfire code...if those codes have not been disabled or set less sensitive in the tune. If the compression is good...

    The phaser solenoids can be tested through diagnostics to see if they are working. Likely the phasers may also be tested and monitored in a similar way to determine if they are working properly through the same advanced diagnostics devices more capable than a simple code reader/data logger. It may be more cost effective at this point to go that route than to keep throwing parts at it. Maybe Mike (NX COUPE) has the equipment to assist you at his shop if you are in his area. Not sure where you are located.
    Last edited by redfirepearlgt; 04-17-2021 at 10:04 AM.
    Redfirepearl GT

  8. #8
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    Feb 2017
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    Compression on bank 2 was 155 on each cylinder. The car has not thrown any codes.

    A buddy is thinking that it maybe a clogged oil passage leading to not enough oil for the phaser...


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  9. #9
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    ^^^ Sounds like a concurring hypothesis to what has been inputted here. Sounds like you have some good backing to tear back into head #2 again. Best of luck.
    Redfirepearl GT

  10. #10
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    Get this resolved?

  11. #11
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    Feb 2017
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    Walter, this has been resolved, thanks for asking. I havenít had a lot of time to get on here and update this as life has been getting in the way.

    Basically after a buddy and a shop looked at it, data logged it some more, and still not knowing what the issue was.... I was taking to my wife about it over dinner (her favorite topic of discussion Iím sure) I got to thinking, maybe itís not a mechanical issue like I was thinking. Maybe itís an electrical issue and just presents itself like mechanical issue.. Anyways after messing around with for a while looking over the electrical system I found it.

    It was a cam position sensor issue. It must have touched part of the firewall at one time or another (itís tight around this plug area) and messed up the plug connector and caused it to back out some. I was able to fix it and put it back in and itís good!


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  12. #12
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    Jan 2008
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    So it was a wiring/harness connector issue. Good find. replacing the missing filters was also a good things while you were in there going over the mechanical side again.

    Glad you found it.
    Redfirepearl GT

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Eastgate
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    Awesome!

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